Ep. 12: Los Cachirules podcast – We talk Pumas vs America and more

Dos a Zero podcast

A Dos a Zero podcast

This was an exciting episode, because we decided to start it right after the Pumas vs America game and while the Tigres vs Toluca game was going on.

You all know how the Pumas vs America game went, so you can imagine certain panelist’s jimmies were most definitely rustled. He had his say and may have spurred a blog post from fellow panelist which you can read here.

My take is, the ref made a mistake by calling the early Pumas goal off. Britos was not offsides and Veron converging in, did not interfere with Moises and was not involved in the play. The call may have been that Britos was offside, and in that case it was wrong. The call could have also been that Veron was interferred, but he was not between Moises and the ball. The ball went so quickly past Moises and Veron that none of them could have done anything to change its trajectory. Clearly a bad call.

No matter, you have to fight through bad calls. It was expected for America to be on attack and to have posession. This an elimination tournament and not a regular season game like had been previously played a couple weeks earlier. It was intense. Memories of Goltz and other Americanistas proving to be hot heads came back. It was a heated and physical game. One stat is that America is the team with the most bookings(red/yellow cards). No change here.

Another stat, in the entire game America had 1 shot on frame. The UNAM defense was strong. I recall seeing cross after cross get headed by a Universitario. First touch and defensive posture was strong with UNAM. Some may say that America possessed and attacked, but didn’t put Pikolin in real danger.

Then came the Red cards. As a result open space for the speedsters, Fidel, Sosa and Britos. Even Lalo Herrera came up big with a very nice Cabezazo!

 

Anyways, we also talked the Neymar showboating issue we have been arguing about. The Real Pundits that claim they would have done the same as Isco and fouled Neymar for acting a fool. I’ll let you have a listen for our differing takes.

We also had some play by play on the Tigres vs Toluca game. All in all a great night for Futbol and good discussion.

Is the curse of Super Lider, legit or rubbish?

Veracruz Super LiderIf you are familiar with the Mexican League and the Liguilla/Playoff, then you know of the “Super Lider curse”. Being at the top of the General Table usually is a good thing. In La Liga, it means you are the champion. Not in the Mexican League. It just means now you have to go into the playoff and win the Championship in a series of home/away games.

The curse is that throughout history it is percieved that the team at the top of the table (aka #1 seed) always fails to win the Cup via playoff and bows out early in quarterfinals or Semis.

So I went back 10 years to get a look at how legit this is. I know as far as my memory goes, the teams that I recall being Super Lider always would fail in the playoffs. My first memories were back when Cuautemoc led lowly Veracruz to an excellent season, only to bow out early in playoffs. This year, Pumas is at the top and being a fan of UNAM I want them to do great. However, I have seen this curse take effect and bring teams down. Or have I?

Going to the cold hard stats, lets look at the past 10 years. In 21 seasons (Apertura/Clausura) the Super Lider has won the Cup 4 times. That is a 19% success rate, not very good, but surprising. I was thinking it would be more like 0%. Maybe some exageration on my part regarding this so called curse? Not even very far back, America beat Tigres to win the Championship in Apertura 2014. Further back in Clausura 2012, Santos did it vs Monterrey. Then we have a gap until we get to Clausura 2007 where Pachuca beats America to win it all. Then just a year passes and we have Pachuca beating San Luis in Clausura 2006.

So as you can see, it can be done, and it has been done. Pumas is now the determined Super Lider in this Apertura 2015 playoffs, so we will see if it can be done again. Can a #1 seeded team take on playoffs and win the Tournament?

On a side note, should the playoffs even exist? Should Mexico go the way of La Liga and crown the team that ends season at the top of the table? We’ll save that topic for another post.  😀

 

Here are the stats I looked up on the Super Lider from each season:

Clausura 2015 – Tigres lose to Santos in Quarterfinals.
Apertura 2014 – America beats Tigres, is Champion.
Clausura 2014 – Cruz Azul loses to Leon in Quarterfinals.
Apertura 2013 – Amercia, loses to Leon in Final.
Clausura 2013 – Tigres lose to Monterrey in Quarterfinals.
Apertura 2012 – Toluca loses to Tijuana in Final.
Clausura 2012 – Santos beat Monterrey in Final.
Apertura 2011 – Chivas lose to Queretaro in Quarterfinals.
Clausura 2011 – Tigres lose to Chivas in Quarterfinals.
Apertura 2010 – Cruz Azul lose to Pumas in Quarterfinals.
Clausura 2010 – Monterrey lose to Pachuca in Quarterfinals.
Apertura 2009 – Toluca lose to Monterrey in Semis.
Clausura 2009 – Pachuca lose to Pumas in Final.
Apertura 2008 – San Luis lose to Santos in Quarterfinals.
Clausura 2008 – Chivas lose to Monterrey.
Apertura 2007 – Santos lose to Pumas in Semis.
Clausura 2007 – Pachuca beats America in Final.
Apertura 2006 – Cruz Azul lose to Chivas in Quarterfinals.
Clausura 2006 – Pachuca beat San Lus in Final.
Apertura 2005 – America lose to Tigres in Quarterfinals.
Clausura 2005 – Morelia loses to Estudiantes in Semis.

CONCACAF Champions League 2015-2016

So the Quarterfinals are set in the CONCAChafa tournament and it turned out that MLS teams will be facing off against LigaMX teams. Here are the matchups:

Tigres vs Real Salt Lake

Queretaro vs DC United

LA Galaxy vs Santos Laguna

Seattle vs America

These matches wont begin until February of next year, so we have some time before we get to see if MLS can do something other than come in 2nd place or less in this tournament. Costa Rican, Honduran and other Central American teams have since been eliminated.

So whats the purpose of this tournament? The Club World Cup is hardly prestigious. For me the interest is exactly what CONCACAF seems to see; MLS vs LigaMX. Mexico has of course dominated this tournament entirely. MLS seems to creep closer, but Mexican teams always end up taking home the cup. Some call this tournament Mickey Mouse, which I agree that to a certain extent it is. Some Mexican teams don’t take it seriously and bring youger players to gain experience. Then you have complaints about portions of the tournament being played before MLS regular season has even begun, thus giving the Mexican teams an advantage. That excuse, however would make the MLS a mickey mouse league for having such a “unique” schedule to their season.

So either way, we get MLS vs Mexico, and we will see if Mexico maintains Kings of CONCACAF! 🙂

Here is an interesting video from the 2011 tournament and buildup from a Real Salt Lake perspective.

 

Tigeres!!!! Rob Schneider is a fan.

I wonder if Rob Schneider knows that Tigres will be playing tomorrow in the CONCACAF Champions league vs Herediano. Either way, Rob is a Tigres fan and wears the jersey proudly.

However, this reminds me of the quote from the movie, My big fat Greek Wedding:

The man is the head, but the woman is the neck. And she can turn the head any way she wants.

Rob’s wife is Mexican so this is most likely the case here. This brings up an interesting topic of why are people choose to be fans of teams? Usually you would think of fans being from the city of the team, but this is not always the case. Now days, you can probably hear the term “plastics”, or fake fans, or fans because a team increases in popularity.

 

This is an interesting, because some say you can’t be a fan if you are not from that city and live there. Yet in Mexico and in the US, you will see many people with Manchester United, Barcelona, Real Madrid or even Messi/Argentina jerseys, who may not have even stepped foot in the cities or countries of these teams.

 

We had a slight discussion on this topic during the Los Cachirules podcast. Make sure you listen in here and give your feedback to our twitter account.sandlersneider

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